Comments for www.blog.therefugeonline.org http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org Thu, 28 Aug 2008 07:22:49 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5 Comment on KARL - First Come, First Called: Who Gets to be in Charge? by david murphy http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2008/08/04/karl-first-come-first-called-who-gets-to-be-in-charge/#comment-547 david murphy Fri, 22 Aug 2008 17:43:52 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/?p=113#comment-547 well said, on both counts. Whatever happened to that spirit that inspired John the Baptist to say "he must increase, and I must decrease". He recognized that a greater than he had arrived, and in truly selfless fashion deferred to him. well said, on both counts. Whatever happened to that spirit that inspired John the Baptist to say “he must increase, and I must decrease”. He recognized that a greater than he had arrived, and in truly selfless fashion deferred to him.

]]> Comment on KARL - First Come, First Called: Who Gets to be in Charge? by Lisa http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2008/08/04/karl-first-come-first-called-who-gets-to-be-in-charge/#comment-499 Lisa Wed, 13 Aug 2008 19:30:12 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/?p=113#comment-499 Gawd. Both of you are funny. Karl in his original article and deb in her witty response. I think one I would modify is: if you have struggled with the same besetting issue for more than 6 months, or have no money, please leave or pretend like the rest of us that everything is okay because only the "world" faces these issues.” I remember a youth minister in my early high school years told me that he was quitting his position (which admittedly he wasn't paid for...though he didn't want the money), because God had opened a door for him to get a promotion in his company, make more money, and move to FL. It pissed me off that he thought God was responsible for that. Who knows...maybe he was. But it sucked for me. 3 years and 5 youth ministers later though...I have to wonder what God was up to if this was really his will. Maybe our search committee for a youth minister just sucked, or they weren't offering enough money for the position. Gawd. Both of you are funny. Karl in his original article and deb in her witty response.

I think one I would modify is: if you have struggled with the same besetting issue for more than 6 months, or have no money, please leave or pretend like the rest of us that everything is okay because only the “world” faces these issues.”

I remember a youth minister in my early high school years told me that he was quitting his position (which admittedly he wasn’t paid for…though he didn’t want the money), because God had opened a door for him to get a promotion in his company, make more money, and move to FL. It pissed me off that he thought God was responsible for that. Who knows…maybe he was. But it sucked for me. 3 years and 5 youth ministers later though…I have to wonder what God was up to if this was really his will. Maybe our search committee for a youth minister just sucked, or they weren’t offering enough money for the position.

]]> Comment on we are the refuge by Lisa http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2008/08/11/we-are-the-refuge/#comment-498 Lisa Wed, 13 Aug 2008 19:20:37 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/?p=114#comment-498 we're pretty good poets. Both collectively and Sage individually. I loved doing this exercise Kathy! we’re pretty good poets. Both collectively and Sage individually. I loved doing this exercise Kathy!

]]> Comment on KARL - First Come, First Called: Who Gets to be in Charge? by Deb http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2008/08/04/karl-first-come-first-called-who-gets-to-be-in-charge/#comment-486 Deb Wed, 06 Aug 2008 23:23:53 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/?p=113#comment-486 You are so dang funny (sar-caustic), making some great points, pointing out some nasty truths, and doing it with your trade mark humor. Loved it! I'm going to attempt to comment here more frequently but I'm more into myself than making sure my friends know they've impacted me with their words. (That wasn't on the list of scenarios you're still waiting to experience...but now you have.) Gotta run, my ass hurts. :-) You are so dang funny (sar-caustic), making some great points, pointing out some nasty truths, and doing it with your trade mark humor. Loved it!

I’m going to attempt to comment here more frequently but I’m more into myself than making sure my friends know they’ve impacted me with their words. (That wasn’t on the list of scenarios you’re still waiting to experience…but now you have.)

Gotta run, my ass hurts. :-)

]]> Comment on CHRISTA - the paths by Deb http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2008/07/21/christa-the-paths/#comment-478 Deb Sat, 02 Aug 2008 17:10:35 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/?p=112#comment-478 Christa, Hi, how are you? (toothy smile) I love knowing that as I walk my various paths (some more poopy than others) there is a good chance I'll look up and see you, or another safe and real person who wants to see...and be seen. With so many of my refuge family, it's exciting to know that I don't have to worry about awkward eye contact, putting on a happy face, or not being seen or heard as our paths converge. I'd love to be the kind of person that I want everyone else to be for me. I'm working on it. (quick nervous hug) Christa,

Hi, how are you? (toothy smile)

I love knowing that as I walk my various paths (some more poopy than others) there is a good chance I’ll look up and see you, or another safe and real person who wants to see…and be seen.

With so many of my refuge family, it’s exciting to know that I don’t have to worry about awkward eye contact, putting on a happy face, or not being seen or heard as our paths converge.

I’d love to be the kind of person that I want everyone else to be for me. I’m working on it. (quick nervous hug)

]]> Comment on CHRISTA - the paths by mike http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2008/07/21/christa-the-paths/#comment-458 mike Thu, 24 Jul 2008 19:18:59 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/?p=112#comment-458 wow girl. you hit the nail right on the head. i work in a retail environment where it is part of my job to greet people. i have had some people answer the question, "how are you?", honestly. sorry to say, in my former life i actually responded to their honest answers (i just lost my spouse, i have a terminal illness, my child is in jail, i'm homeless etc) with a cheery "that's nice". and then trying to do damage control to appear concerned. lol. at celebrate recovery i learned to not only listen for the answer and be actually ready to listen to the answer, but to gently challenge someone who said "i'm doing ok" with the question "are you really?" Christa, i'd much rather stroll down the messy, less traveled, scary, stinky goose poop path, with you, than fake my way, alone, through the emptiness of the slick, plastic, cold uncaring road most traveled. i've noticed that path smells of something too. is it bull.... or maybe death? wow girl. you hit the nail right on the head. i work in a retail environment where it is part of my job to greet people. i have had some people answer the question, “how are you?”, honestly. sorry to say, in my former life i actually responded to their honest answers (i just lost my spouse, i have a terminal illness, my child is in jail, i’m homeless etc) with a cheery “that’s nice”. and then trying to do damage control to appear concerned. lol. at celebrate recovery i learned to not only listen for the answer and be actually ready to listen to the answer, but to gently challenge someone who said “i’m doing ok” with the question “are you really?” Christa, i’d much rather stroll down the messy, less traveled, scary, stinky goose poop path, with you, than fake my way, alone, through the emptiness of the slick, plastic, cold uncaring road most traveled. i’ve noticed that path smells of something too. is it bull…. or maybe death?

]]> Comment on 8 ways to shrink a church by Elaine http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2007/08/14/8-ways-to-shrink-a-church/#comment-457 Elaine Thu, 24 Jul 2008 18:18:36 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/blog/?p=37#comment-457 Clarification - in re-reading - I realize my closing statement "if the church/company can "pass" these first 2 items"... Well, I don't mean it as a pass/fail kind of thing - more of if these 2 qualities are "present" - then I can live in this environment. It is almost like needing air and water. Without these 2 elements, it speaks death to me. Clarification - in re-reading - I realize my closing statement “if the church/company can “pass” these first 2 items”…

Well, I don’t mean it as a pass/fail kind of thing - more of if these 2 qualities are “present” - then I can live in this environment. It is almost like needing air and water. Without these 2 elements, it speaks death to me.

]]> Comment on CHRISTA - the paths by Katie http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2008/07/21/christa-the-paths/#comment-454 Katie Thu, 24 Jul 2008 03:49:09 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/?p=112#comment-454 Thanks for taking that step forward. I love hearing your real answers and know that when you ask how I'm doing, you actually want to know. :) Thanks for taking that step forward. I love hearing your real answers and know that when you ask how I’m doing, you actually want to know. :)

]]> Comment on 8 ways to shrink a church by Elaine http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2007/08/14/8-ways-to-shrink-a-church/#comment-451 Elaine Wed, 23 Jul 2008 23:45:53 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/blog/?p=37#comment-451 Hi Kath, Just read this one...love it. As someone who attended a mega church for 15 years (on staff the last 5 yrs) - and is no longer attending there... I have to say you have it right. After trying to change the system from the inside, I finally realized they didn't want to change. It was mind boggling to realize they were harming staff and volunteers (and themselves) and the response was - "get in line with the program". Ugh! Your list of 8 really calls out the things I found lacking in the megachurch. I have 2 I would add - and there is some overlap here - but I find I begin with these 2 items in measuring every new church, company, association, etc. that I am thinking of becoming a part of: 1. Transparency - transparency in finances, in hiring and firing, promotions, who gets to speak, problems - NO SECRETS - 2. Dissent - is there space for people to disagree with leadership and each other - does leadership model respectfully disagreeing with each other and with others AND are open to admitting when they are wrong - and still remain friends, that the dissenter is not punished. If the church/company can pass these first 2 items - then I know it is a place where we can have conversations about your 8. thanks, E Hi Kath,

Just read this one…love it.

As someone who attended a mega church for 15 years (on staff the last 5 yrs) - and is no longer attending there…

I have to say you have it right. After trying to change the system from the inside, I finally realized they didn’t want to change. It was mind boggling to realize they were harming staff and volunteers (and themselves) and the response was - “get in line with the program”. Ugh!

Your list of 8 really calls out the things I found lacking in the megachurch.

I have 2 I would add - and there is some overlap here - but I find I begin with these 2 items in measuring every new church, company, association, etc. that I am thinking of becoming a part of:

1. Transparency - transparency in finances, in hiring and firing, promotions, who gets to speak, problems - NO SECRETS -

2. Dissent - is there space for people to disagree with leadership and each other - does leadership model respectfully disagreeing with each other and with others AND are open to admitting when they are wrong - and still remain friends, that the dissenter is not punished.

If the church/company can pass these first 2 items - then I know it is a place where we can have conversations about your 8.

thanks, E

]]> Comment on CHRISTA - the paths by Steve http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/2008/07/21/christa-the-paths/#comment-442 Steve Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:51:37 +0000 http://www.blog.therefugeonline.org/?p=112#comment-442 Christa, I love how this piece cuts through the 'goose poop' and goes right to the chase. I've often wondered what people would do if one took the time to answer all the rhetorical questions they ask in place of salutation. A look of shock, perhaps? A quick retort followed by a spontanious excuse of why they can't actually stick around for the end (often given as they are walking backwards) of the answer? The possibilities are restricted only by the creativity of the individuals. Your piece does make me wonder which path is really laden with 'goose poop'. I'm grateful to share space in a community with you and Paul. Thanks for sharing, Steve Christa, I love how this piece cuts through the ‘goose poop’ and goes right to the chase. I’ve often wondered what people would do if one took the time to answer all the rhetorical questions they ask in place of salutation.

A look of shock, perhaps? A quick retort followed by a spontanious excuse of why they can’t actually stick around for the end (often given as they are walking backwards) of the answer?

The possibilities are restricted only by the creativity of the individuals.

Your piece does make me wonder which path is really laden with ‘goose poop’.

I’m grateful to share space in a community with you and Paul.

Thanks for sharing, Steve

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